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Go to hell or banish forever?

Which version of death do you perfer?  

10 members have voted

  1. 1. Choose!

    • Go to hell and go under severe torture for eternity
      0
    • Blank out after you just die.
      6
    • I don't believe in hell / etc.
      4
    • I am not a sinner - I dont curse, get jealous, and forgive my neighbor for fucking my wife
      0


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I had an argument with my friend, and he actually said he would rather suffer in hell for eternity then just blank out when dieing. By suffering, we meant like being drowned but not dieing, burning for ever, or being whipped for 1000's of years. Something, just like really awful. Which would you perfer?

 

I want to know if its just me or maybe hes insane. I think skinny people have a fear of death, almost all the ectomorphs I know perfer to go to hell over dieing. I guess that can make sense, after all people with shitty lives dont always kill themselves, but that could be because maybe they need to be there for somebody else. To survive is to find meaning in sufferage.

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"I don't believe in hell / etc."

anyone here know anything about the merkaba

 

AFAIK every religion that believes in reincarnation/transmigration of the soul also believes in hell realms, including Hinduism, Buddhism, and some sects of Sufism.

 

Pratāpana – the "great heating" Naraka (hell). Life in this Naraka is 42,467,328*10^10 years long.

 

See, it's not even eternal.

 

Smokin! :ph34r:

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What are you trying to get at with this thread.

 

Eschatological beliefs are extremely varied among Christians. Many of them are quite off the mark, IMO. One's hermeneutical approach to the Bible as well as their broader ontological/metaphysical views will determine the nature of a given Christian's position.

 

My particular stance on hell requires delivery/presentation of my ontology/metaphysic as a framework within which hell is conceptualized. The extremely short version is that I believe hell is not at all a literal lake of fire/sulfur or state of extreme physical torture. Rather it is simply eternal unembodied isolation.

 

I believe that if you truly get to the bottom of reality/life, you will see that its simply a relational continum. Love is both the substance and the process by which entities increase or maximize relational existence. The exact opposite of this relational state is pure isolation. If you have tasted this concept of hell and at least seen a glimmer of its weight and significance, you will have potentially realized how truly horrible this is. I wish I could say I think its annhiliation, but I fear its not that good.

 

While we're at this, I also would say that if you want to find the real basis for Sin, its pride. And the associated result of this is isolation. Various psychoactive drugs are useful for understanding this, or at least gleaming it. This is just where I've come to, not wanting to act like I've got everything figured out, as I surely do not by any means. I should also note that I realize what I've put forth here is quite lacking in terms of philosophical formalization, but I don't really care.

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Excellent post,Tom and I wholeheartedley agree.

 

Fuck any philosophical formalization,I should add.This is a relatively simple albeit apparently complex concept and you've articulated your thoughts in a clear and concise manner.

 

OTOH,some things should not be glossed over at all.Such as rooting such an issue of all the possibilities of heaven and hell within a poll format.

 

Hehe.

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While we're at this, I also would say that if you want to find the real basis for Sin, its pride. And the associated result of this is isolation.

 

Pride... egotism, delusion, an incorrect view of reality that gives inherent existence to the self and denies oneness. In this one sees differences, comparisons, instead of unity, and one has isolated themselves.

 

This attachment to the ego leads to clinging to things or pushing away based on these comparisons, if they are a threat to the ego, or considered beneficial.

 

In clinging to things in this manner, one is never fulfilled, one is never satisfied, and this is a cause of suffering.

 

In pushing things away, one is isolated, and this is a cause of suffering.

 

In saying "this form is mine, I am this form", the form is subject to change, which brings with it the suffering of change.

 

Well, that's the Buddhist philosophy along those lines.

 

I should also note that I realize what I've put forth here is quite lacking in terms of philosophical formalization, but I don't really care.

 

That's pretty fucking enlightened if you came up with that yourself :P

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How you can intermingle,or free associate if you prefer,pride as the basis of sin along with egoism is beyond me.

 

Egoism and sin are relative but pride?

 

Pride in a self delusional sense of heightened vainity at the expense of others is itself wrong but one is hardly applicable to the other.

 

I take pride in my work,not in myself i.e. physical appearance,material gains and so on and I'm mildly offended by these statements.I am drunk however so that is all I have to say except fuck the two of you.

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How you can intermingle,or free associate if you prefer,pride as the basis of sin along with egoism is beyond me.

 

Egoism and sin are relative but pride?

 

Pride in a self delusional sense of heightened vainity at the expense of others is itself wrong but one is hardly applicable to the other.

 

Egotism is required for pride; it is the very concept of "I" as a composite entity of changing factors. Attachment to egotism results in pushing things away considered threatening to the ego, and pulling towards and becoming attached to things considered benefiting the ego. Thus, pride.

 

I take pride in my work,not in myself i.e. physical appearance,material gains and so on and I'm mildly offended by these statements.I am drunk however so that is all I have to say except fuck the two of you.

 

See? Attachment creates suffering. If you are mildly offended, you are not feeling happiness.

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Egotism is required for pride; it is the very concept of "I" as a composite entity of changing factors. Attachment to egotism results in pushing things away considered threatening to the ego, and pulling towards and becoming attached to things considered benefiting the ego. Thus, pride.

 

Yes,I understand all of this as it is readily self evident.I was not disputing what is obvios,there is simply nothing to dispute but your implication is a bit extreme.

 

See? Attachment creates suffering. If you are mildly offended, you are not feeling happiness.

 

Yes,I understand all of this as it is readily self evident.I was not disputing what is obvios,there is simply nothing to dispute but your implication is a bit extreme.

 

I'll concede to the latter point as well,in the sense you've laid it out.But I was talking about pride in the sense of overcoming which is a different concept altogether.

 

It was a drunken post,cough cough,but in lieu of editing it or explaining any feeling of offense and WRT the "fuck you both" comment I will let it stand as a testament to my own impatience/idiocy.

 

 

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Yes,I understand all of this as it is readily self evident.I was not disputing what is obvios,there is simply nothing to dispute but your implication is a bit extreme.

 

I'll concede to the latter point as well,in the sense you've laid it out.But I was talking about pride in the sense of overcoming which is a different concept altogether.

 

It was a drunken post,cough cough,but in lieu of editing it or explaining any feeling of offense and WRT the "fuck you both" comment I will let it stand as a testament to my own impatience/idiocy.

 

Beer is good?

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Yes,Godamnit,Yes!!!!

 

 

 

Alcohol is the best friend I've ever had :)

 

Alcohol susbtituting twinkies a'la Jello Biafra's I Fought TheLaw,two cents to that guy.

 

 

I prefer to get down with fruit laden drinks.Pina coladas,daquiri's and so on but yeah,beer does the trick as well.JD's Honey Brown lager is the only ale I've tasted that was remotely palatable,if not in dire need of simply getting loused.

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This thread doesn't make much sense, but, what the hell. When polled, I answered "I don't believe in Hell." Well, that's not exactley true. I don't know what "religion" I fall into, and frankily, I don't give a fuck. THe point being, however, that I believe that when you die, you will either spend the rest of eternity in peace with everyone of every religion an race, if you deserve it. If, however, you were wicked during you time on Earth, then you will be punished most severley. Then if you weren't good or bad, then you go back to Earth and try again. But the poll was, would you rather die, or go to hell. Which doesn't make sense, seeing as you would have to die in order to go to hell, and why would you want to go to hell before your time was up?

Whatever, religion is entirely impossible to wrap your head around.

 

P.S. Anyone know what religion (if any) my beliefs fit into?

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This thread doesn't make much sense, but, what the hell. When polled, I answered "I don't believe in Hell." Well, that's not exactley true. I don't know what "religion" I fall into, and frankily, I don't give a fuck. THe point being, however, that I believe that when you die, you will either spend the rest of eternity in peace with everyone of every religion an race, if you deserve it. If, however, you were wicked during you time on Earth, then you will be punished most severley. Then if you weren't good or bad, then you go back to Earth and try again. But the poll was, would you rather die, or go to hell. Which doesn't make sense, seeing as you would have to die in order to go to hell, and why would you want to go to hell before your time was up?

Whatever, religion is entirely impossible to wrap your head around.

 

P.S. Anyone know what religion (if any) my beliefs fit into?

 

Transmigration of the soul / reincarnation / karma... present in Buddhism, Brahmanism (Hinduism), and some Sufi sects of Islam. There are also some less popular sects of Christianity and Judaism that share these beliefs. I'd recommend reading this as a start.

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How you can intermingle,or free associate if you prefer,pride as the basis of sin along with egoism is beyond me.

 

Egoism and sin are relative but pride?

 

Pride in a self delusional sense of heightened vainity at the expense of others is itself wrong but one is hardly applicable to the other.

 

I take pride in my work,not in myself i.e. physical appearance,material gains and so on and I'm mildly offended by these statements.I am drunk however so that is all I have to say except fuck the two of you.

 

yea, but i suspect that if you're like most men, your sense of self is hopelessly entangled with your work. it defines you. pride in your work is therefore pride in yourself.

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Egotism is required for pride; it is the very concept of "I" as a composite entity of changing factors. Attachment to egotism results in pushing things away considered threatening to the ego, and pulling towards and becoming attached to things considered benefiting the ego. Thus, pride.

See? Attachment creates suffering. If you are mildly offended, you are not feeling happiness.

So what is the alternative?

 

How indeed would we even continue to exist without ego. Why would one even post on a message board?

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yea, but i suspect that if you're like most men, your sense of self is hopelessly entangled with your work. it defines you. pride in your work is therefore pride in yourself.

 

This has already been adressed a couple posts above.I'll add that your assumption is not based remotely on fact and that you know nothing WRT what personal sacrifices hard work entails,based upon the subpar ethics you hold that are overtly displayed within the mere three sentences you wrote.

 

One should take pride in willing to make sacrifices,whereas the overwhelming majority of people in this world are not remotely willing to do so.IOW they lack the requisite character and the will to power which would summon the greatness in themselves.

 

Now that you've seemingly invalidated my existence with your poorly crafted line of thought,what drives you?

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So what is the alternative?

 

How indeed would we even continue to exist without ego. Why would one even post on a message board?

 

I never said ego didn't exist. Just that it didn't have inherent, independent, unchanging existence. The alternative is to recognize the "ego" for what it truly is-- a collection of changing factors that does serve a purpose, but that being attached too strongly to it, thinking "this is all of me", or being deluded into thinking it is unchanging quite often results in suffering. The entire basis of mindfulness and meditation is consciousness of the ego.

 

"It's not that you're dreaming. It's that you are the dream."

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Blah,blah,blah.

 

I find your signature,along with your user name and your avatar,damn annoying.

 

 

 

Anyone care to start a betting pool regarding users blood alcohol levels while posting?

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This has already been adressed a couple posts above.I'll add that your assumption is not based remotely on fact and that you know nothing WRT what personal sacrifices hard work entails,based upon the subpar ethics you hold that are overtly displayed within the mere three sentences you wrote.

 

One should take pride in willing to make sacrifices,whereas the overwhelming majority of people in this world are not remotely willing to do so.IOW they lack the requisite character and the will to power which would summon the greatness in themselves.

 

Now that you've seemingly invalidated my existence with your poorly crafted line of thought,what drives you?

 

you do, brother. you inspire me. how much to take your seminar?

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Why bother with the sarcasm,I did not condescend to you in any manner.

 

Especially with consideration given to the fact that you evaded the question entirely,I find it a bit weak that you responded with a half assed retort.

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Why bother with the sarcasm,I did not condescend to you in any manner.

 

Especially with consideration given to the fact that you evaded the question entirely,I find it a bit weak that you responded with a half assed retort.

 

Oh come on Colin, pull the other one, it has bells on it.

 

While you are a fine man, you've been stumbling through this thread like the living embodiment of in vino veritas... you suddenly want everyone to start acting like you're engaging them a serious structured debate?

 

(full disclosure: I too, am in my cups. Good night.)

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Proton Soup has contributed fuck all to this discussion and for that matter,has contributed fuck all to any other thread as well.

 

So then,bingo,my tone is hardly out of line.

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You're an ass and just won't admit it. YOU have contributed fuck all to this conversation, because you feel the need to prove yourself by pissing people off. Now my post may not be as neat or facile as geigers, but as this is an end of a thread (b/c you ruined it, I might add), I feel no shame in being a complete bitch to you, b/c you whole-heartedly deserve it. And please stop posting whilst drunk.

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Group hug, bitches.

 

Suppose an enemy has hurt you

In his own domain.

Why should you annoy yourself

And hurt your mind in your domain?

 

In tears you left your family,

They who were kind and helpful always.

So why not leave behind your enemy

And the anger that brings so much harm?

 

This anger which you embrace

Eats away at the very roots

Of all the virtues you strive to develop.

Who would be such a fool?

 

Someone else does evil deeds

And you get angry. Why?

Do you wish to copy him

And act as he does?

 

Suppose someone, to annoy,

Provokes you to do some evil act.

Why allow anger to arise and thus

Do exactly as he wants you to do?

 

If you get angry

Then maybe he will suffer, maybe not.

But by feeling anger yourself

You certainly do suffer.

 

If enemies blinded by anger

Are content to walk the path of woe,

Do you wish to follow them

By getting angry yourself?

 

If a foe provokes you

To hurt yourself by getting angry,

Let that anger subside.

Do not harm yourself needlessly.

 

-The Buddha Siddhartha Gautama

 

"Be... excellent to each other."

"Party on, dudes."

 

-Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure

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:lol::lol::lol:

 

Good thread,by all accounts.

 

I feel compelled to state that Frangible is.....greeeat a'la Tony The Tiger,and I love this hippie-esque motherfucker as he deftly evades common pitfalls that most granola headed hippies seem prone to :wub:

 

If I had the requisite means to do so,I would send you as much free Avant product as your heart desired.

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