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Sabercat

Dedication or Dementia?

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I wonder sometimes if we use our sport to "get back" at life.

Hmm, interesting thought, I'm quite sure that in some aspects this is true for many people, myself included.

 

Delphinus, very sincere and insightful post, thanks for sharing; same for the rest, some very good reads here, I'm impressed at what some have the willingness and ability to reveal.

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"Getting back at life". When younger, perhaps true. But that's a different state of absurdity, another abyss to drown yourself in. What was once motivation will quickly consume and then destroy you. And this extends to every facet of life: business, personal, and so on further to where our discontent could lead us.

 

As with art---you exact revenge by showing people what they're missing out on.

 

As for motivation, I now see that there's more benefit in being healthy, than not. And one need not be 300 pounds of muscle in order to be muscular so my goals now bask within a different light.

 

Meaning can be found in the mere struggle.

 

That's what I've always thought. God, Statan, Heaven and Hell are all to me absurd. And when I think deeply enough about this world and the people who stain it, I can easily rouse myself to hysterical laughter. But the fact remains, you're here, you exist. So while upon this world you might as well make your impression.

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Meaning can be found in the mere struggle.

 

Delphinus,

 

A truly enlightening, and brave, post. To echo Dante's sentiment, I would add that meaning can ONLY be found in the struggle, in life-as-process and our continual journay toward self-actualization.

 

Icequeen,

 

I do indeed know exactly what you are getting at. When younger, I always had a bit of a stomach. Nothing significant, but I was self-conscious nonetheless, wishing to be one of those ectomorphic kids who had a six-pack at the age of ten. The danger in this desire for self-cultivation is that it can transform itself--quietly so--into nothing more than capitulation to societal 'expectations.' If this occurs, a once original act of defiance becomes nothing more than inadvertant conformity, and one's own inner self is sacrificed upon the alter of the mob (Dante, I threw that one in for you laugh.gif ).

 

On a similar note, this is my biggest issue with many 'rebels' or 'non-conformists': they seek not to define themselves in terms of self-originated values or goals, but rather in diametrical oppositon to what is 'normal.' This is not original, and is by no means any different than adhering to the 'standard' upon which one is rebelling.

 

The difficulty lies in striking a balance between genuine self-expression and inadvertant submission (Through which, paradoxically, REACTION can be a primary conduit) to societal messages.

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Don't know how I missed this thread before, but just want to say it's outstanding. Other than that, I don't have anything else to add, really, that hasn't already been brought up.

 

I seem to miss out on most of the good discussions. sad.gif

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, this is my biggest issue with many 'rebels' or 'non-conformists':

 

From another board I quote myself: Blind cynicism (rebellion) is a different form of obedience.

 

They set an eye to everyone but themsevles to determine what course of action to pursue.

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When one decides that the definition of obsession or dedication depends on perspective of each individual, there is no real point in talking about the original thread topic ... In other words, the topic of whether dedication/obsession depends on each one's perspective probably deserves another thread.

 

To rein in the original topic, it is advantageous to consider the "common" definition of "dedication" and "obsession." I think it is not unreasonable to view "dedication" as the state of being in which one _practices_ some acts repeatedly over a prolonged duration for a goal or to achieve certain effect. Obsession is mainly about behavior in which one's thought process is consumed by a single topic, to the exclusion of other daily activities.

 

By the preceding definitions, dedication and obsession cover different behavior patterns. One who is dedicated may or may not be obsessed. And the converse is true as well.

 

Given the above definitions, now we are in a better position to tackle the question Sabercat asks. The question boils down to "How does one stay dedicated to BB without displaying obsessive behavior?"

 

One answer to the preceding question has already been answered by many particpants in this thread. The anwer lies along the lines of keeping one's priorities and keeping one's life in balance. I think, however, this answer does not go deep enough. It begs the question, how does one keep one's life in balance?

 

In my experience, the only way not to become "obsessed" is to reserve some part of yourself from being 100% enganged in what you love. No matter how overwhelming an activity maybe, there has to be an anchor in one's mind, an anchor that can pull you out of the depths of one's thoughts at any instant.

 

To give a crude example, consider emotions related to attraction. Specifically, I am talking about the feeling that makes you always want to be with her/him. To give into this feeling brings pleasure ; the sight, sound, and the touch of that special person is satisfying.

 

Unfortuantely, to totall give into this feeling generally promotes deterioration of the relationship, if the object of your desire does not feel the same level of passion toward you, as you toward her/him. In such circumstance, it is advisable to give the other party room to breath. To demand time from the other party commensurate with the extent of _your_ feelings would exhaust the other party, until only boredom remained in the relationship, and the other party would have no choice but to leave. It is important to reserve some part of yourself, so that depiste all the overwhelming feelings of attraction, you can still pull yourself out of the onrush of thoughs ONLY about the other person. Put differently, one has to maintain a sense of identity and sobriety.

 

There is no other way to achieve this, than to make dailly, conscious effort, to keep a modicum of detachment in one's life, from all things.

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A (freudian?) slip-up on my part, but perhaps a good-one! I meant Satan, although the notion of our States/Society is equally absurd. Statan is now a new word penned in my lexicon smile.gif

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Is it fate that i stumbled upon this thread? I never really took an interest in this "The Lyceum" section. In fact, i accidentally click on it, i was wanting to visit "The Garbage" section instead. laugh.gif

 

This thread kinda ties in with my posts (actually, my rant) in the "Diet" section, with Colin giving me his "tough love" and Elcypz's wake up call to me. Sabercat's first post in this thread is what i have been pondering about for almost 2 years since i started bodybuilding.

 

From as far back as i can remember, i was a 14 year old with very severe acne problems back then. I have cystic acne on my cheeks and alot of blackheads on my nose. You wouldnt believe the kind of sebum production i had. My face was literally dripping with oil a few hours after i wash my face. Nevertheless, i was very affected. I tried hard to stay at home all day, my daily thoughts were only focused on it, i poured thousands of dollars into facial treatments, pick and squeeze my pimples because i jus couldnt stand the sight of it. Infections came and a vicious cycle set in. My problems were more mental then physical. It affected my studies, my social life and i had very low self esteem. I always had this thought that everyone was looking at my face and thinking how ugly and dirty i look. I hate those yellowish lights: somehow they make me even more self conscious. My face turned red everytime i talk to someone.

 

Friends and classmates took advantage of my low esteem and i was constantly doubting myself. I wasnt talking alot but, thinking alot in my mind. Subconsciously, i was asking myself alot of questions and whys. It was also during this time that i discover what the mind can do. The phrase, "Ask and you shall receive" happens alot of time in my case. As Anthony Robbins said, by constantly asking yourself, you make yourself more aware to the things that can answer your questions. Unknowingly, i was asking myself, why dont i have many friends? What can i do to treat my face? etc etc. All these kinda set into motion, a series of action that lead me to what i wanted. I stumbled upon treatment that undo most of the damage i have done to my face (it cannot be restored 100% because of the scars i inflicted by picking). The failures and frustration i experienced while handling relationships enable me to better understand human beings behaviour.

 

I dont really have an identity then and guess how i got into bodybuilding? A comment "you are thin and weak" by a person whom i dont like at that time was the spark. How coincidence was it when i was going to gym for fun at that time?? I grab onto bodybuilding immediately and it become my identity because i was unique within the people around me.

In this life there's a strange irony. We are all looking for a certain defining individuality but we also want to share that with others like us. It's not a rugged individualism but just something that makes us different from most. And bodybuilding sure does offers that to us.

 

The above by Berardi (thanks duque21).

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I have been in the same boat and mindset of Delphinus.

 

I'm not going to go through all since it is almost the same story. My goal was "perfection", and of course, led to extremes - destructive ones.

 

In the end, the goal we should all be striving for is balance and harmony. It sometimes takes a lifetime to get there, but the journey is what makes it all interesting.

 

Peace.

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I am not afraid to admit that i am sedentary now. I am procrasinating, putting off my return to the gym because something is holding me back in my mind and i just cannot seen to express it well. But when i read posts here, i relate to it so well. Dante, you echo so many of my views.

 

Bodybuilding took over my life before. My self esteem was at an all time low the years before i started bodybuilding. But i started to see results after a few months in the gym and i was simply elated. I mean, here for the first time in my life, i am doing well at something and i got a great body. I become heavily involved in it, at the expense of my social life. It wasnt obvious to me because i was having great progess. But when i hit a plateau, my attention kinda shifts to the other areas of my life. I was lonely, no friendships and my emotional detachment from my family doesnt help. My perception was changing at the same time: I was thinking, "whats the use of building such a big body? isnt all this a vanity pursuit? why is this sport so isolated?" I mean, its not as useful or important as eg. "spending time with loved ones, enriching one's mind and ensuring a strong financial foundation for retirement" right?

 

Its funny how i seen people my age (i am 19) not having the kind of in-depth thinking about life i have. I hesitate to talk about such issues when around them and adjust myself to speak like them. Am i "too matured" in my thinking?

 

It seems that "balance", "variety" and "moderation" are standards every human being have to live by for a fulfilling and happy life overall.

 

(as being single minded is needed [to a certain extent] to achieve great feats).

 

 

Dante, how true is that! I read about people who achieved phemenonal success in a particular area and the similarities in the ways they got their goals, single-mindedness being one of them. With my current mindset, it seems, to be successful, one has to be "ruthless", "selfish", "shrewd" etc. An example would be Anthony Robbins. i am not saying he is literally ruthless. Though he is preaching things that are beneficial to people, he is also charging ridiculously high amounts of money for his seminars. To be successful, it seems one still has to look out for themselves ultimately.

 

On the other hand, though these people may be successful, they often have problems in other areas like poor health, severe illnesses, broken families. This shows that theres no balance in their life but to be successful, they have to be single minded. WTF?? By optimizing A, you risk underdeveloping B. By ensuring balance in both A and B, you cant have optimization in anyone!

 

To be a "jack of all trades" or "master of one trade" (i modified it)??

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In my experience, the only way not to become "obsessed" is to reserve some part of yourself from being 100% enganged in what you love. No matter how overwhelming an activity maybe, there has to be an anchor in one's mind, an anchor that can pull you out of the depths of one's thoughts at any instant.

 

To give a crude example, consider emotions related to attraction. Specifically, I am talking about the feeling that makes you always want to be with her/him. To give into this feeling brings pleasure ; the sight, sound, and the touch of that special person is satisfying.

 

Unfortuantely, to totall give into this feeling generally promotes deterioration of the relationship, if the object of your desire does not feel the same level of passion toward you, as you toward her/him. In such circumstance, it is advisable to give the other party room to breath. To demand time from the other party commensurate with the extent of _your_ feelings would exhaust the other party, until only boredom remained in the relationship, and the other party would have no choice but to leave. It is important to reserve some part of yourself, so that depiste all the overwhelming feelings of attraction, you can still pull yourself out of the onrush of thoughs ONLY about the other person. Put differently, one has to maintain a sense of identity and sobriety.

 

There is no other way to achieve this, than to make dailly, conscious effort, to keep a modicum of detachment in one's life, from all things.

 

VC, this is so damn true as well. I have this in me long ago but i just couldnt express it out and well. i used to think that my thoughts are crazy and that nobody would think the way i would. You reinforce my thinking very well.

 

Its so ironic that one should prevent oneself from becoming 100& engaged to an activity in order to prevent burnout in the long term. But to become successful at it, often you have to be single minded. I am contemplating whether to pursue life sciences related studies for my university degree. BB has always been a hobby and i am afraid i will get sick of it if i make the related subjects my occupation.

 

Regarding the emotions related to attractions, its true as well! If you have been in a relationship, you experience it first hand. Funnily, the key to a great relationship, "is to not care so much or put too much effort into it" Let it have more space.

 

I have wondered whether this is the reason why men like woman who are a challenge to them or play hard to get. laugh.gif

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I dont mean to sound pushy on this. But why isnt anyone giving comments or advice on what i wrote?

 

Flame or ridcule, it doesnt matter. I want to learn.

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Sometimes a person may post good material and I enjoy reading it, but I may not have anything of substance to add. So, rather than trying to be "courteous" and ending up saying something meaningless, I just stay put.

 

There are two possible scenarios when I write something "meaningless": (1) other members will see my BS for what it is and think "VC is b.s.'er," which is sort of annoying, because I ended up making myself looking dumb/insincere about something I did not care to fight for (2) other members may think my b.s. is interesting and respond to it ... in which case, I will probably need to respond again (since I made myself into a "courteous person") and again and again.

 

So, you see, it is best to abstain from posting "hollow" threads.

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I dont mean to sound pushy on this. But why isnt anyone giving comments or advice on what i wrote?

 

Flame or ridcule, it doesnt matter. I want to learn.

Drop and give me a 100,ya maggot....there's some more "tough love"/advice for you.j/k.The only real advice i can give you,considering i don't know you personally,is to literally force yourself to go to the gym.Believe me when i tell you that I know what depression can do to your soul and i apoligize if you mistook my other words out of meaning,I didn't ean to be spiteful.Also the post was to Dot and not yourself but I'm babbling now and that's besides the point anyway.

 

This is the most thought provoking thread I've read on this site by far.I am completely obsessed with lifting and I honestly cannot decide if that is a good thing or not.I began weight lifting about 1/2 year ago,previous to that I was literally addicted to cardio,running for 3 hours daily....for around 2 years.needless to say i was completely delusional and had/still have body dysmorphia.There's a girl,I was friends with for a while and i had the chance to develop a meaningful relationship with her but b/c of the fact that I lack even a shred of self confidence I shyed away from her,for all intents and purposes i blew her off completely.I see her quite often and she was intersted in me up into a point but seeing as I avoid even making eye contact with her she sees me as a joke of a man.Albeit that is without the doubt my case,I have truly become the quintessential "pussy boy".Something finally clicked inside of me,just today in fact,maybe a combination of the holiday & my own self imposed isolation and misery,but I will try to explain myself to her and somehow aplogize,I am crushed with sorrow at thwe thought of her and how I've acted,what I've let myself become.

Woooooow and Delph thought he was wasting space in this thread.

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I really hate it when people bump old threads like this (or however it was that this thread showed itself again).

 

Mainly for two reasons: Some people no longer post and then someone will jump in an try to argue with a person who can't put on a defense.

 

Two: If you made some ridiculous or sloppy argument from three years ago then it makes for a butchered debate if you try to get back into it (that is: "what I meant was," "what I would say now is," so on.).

 

A lot of these older topics could be started anew with a fresh perspective. I certainly wouldn't consider this a "best of." This should be kept in mind with all older threads before they're bumped.

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I don't see how it was bumped as the last post was made by myself over three years ago but,yes I clearly remember this thread.

 

The woman I alluded to in the last post made;I ended up in a fucked up relationship with for a bit shy of half a year.

 

Ugh,I cringe in disdain at what a self obsessed wanker I was during that period of my life ph34r.gif

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